- mice-discuss - lists.micemn.net

Re: Looking Glasses

by Matthew Beckwell

Caught me with my looking glass down... Didn't think anyone would be "looking" at ours yet :) ~Matthew -----Original Message----- From: MICE Discuss [mailto:MICE-DISCUSS@LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET] On Behalf Of Richard Laager Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2011 1:17 PM To: MICE-DISCUSS(a)LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET Subject: Re: [MICE-DISCUSS] Looking Glasses On Tue, 2011-09-27 at 11:00 -0500, Jay Hanke wrote: > If you have links, I'd be happy to add them, it would be handy. For the carriers listed on the participants page, these are the ones I'm aware of (or found via a Google search): http://lg.he.net/ (Reid from HE already mentioned this one.) http://noc.visi.com/lg http://as13746.net/ (seems to be down at the moment) Richard ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1 ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 27, 2011

Re: Akamai Servers are in!

by Doug McIntyre

On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 01:40:14PM -0500, Jay Hanke wrote: > The Akamai servers are in! I'm going to be at 511 about 3 pm. If you > have time and want to help out come on down! So, are they going to do video caching on the cluster there like the U of MN has? Or is it just the web page cluster ? ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 27, 2011

Re: Akamai Servers are in!

by Mike Hemphill

The cabinet space is 14U high -----Original Message----- From: MICE Discuss [mailto:MICE-DISCUSS@LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET] On Behalf Of Jay Hanke Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2011 1:40 PM To: MICE-DISCUSS(a)LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET Subject: [MICE-DISCUSS] Akamai Servers are in! The Akamai servers are in! I'm going to be at 511 about 3 pm. If you have time and want to help out come on down! It looks like we're going to need a couple of rack mount PDUs. If you have one or two available please contact me. I think we're going to need about 12 outlets but I'm not sure exactly until I see the equipment. From the sounds of it the Akamai supplied strips might not fit in the enclosure. Thanks! Jay ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1 ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 27, 2011

Akamai Servers are in!

by Jay Hanke

The Akamai servers are in! I'm going to be at 511 about 3 pm. If you have time and want to help out come on down! It looks like we're going to need a couple of rack mount PDUs. If you have one or two available please contact me. I think we're going to need about 12 outlets but I'm not sure exactly until I see the equipment. From the sounds of it the Akamai supplied strips might not fit in the enclosure. Thanks! Jay ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 27, 2011

Re: Looking Glasses

by Richard Laager

On Tue, 2011-09-27 at 11:00 -0500, Jay Hanke wrote: > If you have links, I'd be happy to add them, it would be handy. For the carriers listed on the participants page, these are the ones I'm aware of (or found via a Google search): http://lg.he.net/ (Reid from HE already mentioned this one.) http://noc.visi.com/lg http://as13746.net/ (seems to be down at the moment) Richard ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 27, 2011

Re: Looking Glasses

by Hannigan, Martin

Thanks, but I'll pass. I'm on my third Dunkin' Donuts XL today, and likely another before 4 EDT. ;-) Best, -M< On 9/27/11 1:07 PM, "Jay Hanke" <jayhanke(a)MANKATONETWORKS.NET> wrote: >> Specifically mentioned the route servers - drink more coffee! >> > > Also specifically mentioned links to carriers looking glass servers, > care to join me for a cup? > > j > > ######################################################################## > > To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: > http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1 ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 27, 2011

Re: Looking Glasses

by Jay Hanke

> Specifically mentioned the route servers - drink more coffee! > Also specifically mentioned links to carriers looking glass servers, care to join me for a cup? j ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 27, 2011

Re: Looking Glasses

by Mike Horwath

On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 11:00:06AM -0500, Jay Hanke wrote: > On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 8:47 AM, Mike Horwath <drechsau(a)iphouse.net> wrote: > > bird and LG isn't really a good match without hackery. > > > > There has been a discussion here before. > > I think he's talking about having a link from the participants page to > any carrier that has their own looking glass. > > If you have links, I'd be happy to add them, it would be handy. Specifically mentioned the route servers - drink more coffee! -- Mike Horwath ipHouse - Welcome home! drechsau(a)iphouse.net The universe is an island, surrounded by whatever it is that surrounds universes. - Berkeley Fortune ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 27, 2011

Re: Looking Glasses

by Reid Fishler

http://lg.he.net :-) On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 12:00 PM, Jay Hanke <jayhanke(a)mankatonetworks.net>wrote: > On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 8:47 AM, Mike Horwath <drechsau(a)iphouse.net> > wrote: > > bird and LG isn't really a good match without hackery. > > > > There has been a discussion here before. > > I think he's talking about having a link from the participants page to > any carrier that has their own looking glass. > > If you have links, I'd be happy to add them, it would be handy. > > Jay > > ######################################################################## > > To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: > http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1 > > -- Reid Fishler Director Hurricane Electric +1-510-580-4178 ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 27, 2011

Re: Looking Glasses

by Jay Hanke

On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 8:47 AM, Mike Horwath <drechsau(a)iphouse.net> wrote: > bird and LG isn't really a good match without hackery. > > There has been a discussion here before. I think he's talking about having a link from the participants page to any carrier that has their own looking glass. If you have links, I'd be happy to add them, it would be handy. Jay ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 27, 2011

Re: Looking Glasses

by Doug McIntyre

On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 03:08:54AM -0500, Richard Laager wrote: > Is there a looking glass running on the route servers? It would be problematic to do such a thing on the route servers themselves, as the nature of what bird does would require root access for whatever web CGI process to get any information out of them. That would be alot of careful coding to make it all right. I did spin up a proof of concept virtual machine of taking a read-only BGP feed off the RRs and providing looking glass web and route-view CLI access to the data, but nobody seemed interested at all in it, so it was idled. That probably is the cleanest way to do anything, getting the route data to *something else*, it can do whatever it wants with it, rather than trying to write something secure around bird. -- Doug McIntyre <merlyn(a)iphouse.net> -- ipHouse/Goldengate/Bitstream/ProNS -- Network Engineer/Provisioning/Jack of all Trades ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 27, 2011

Re: Looking Glasses

by Mike Horwath

bird and LG isn't really a good match without hackery. There has been a discussion here before. -- Mike Horwath via iPad 2, electric boogaloo! ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 27, 2011

Looking Glasses

by Richard Laager

I'd like to see http://micemn.net/participants.html contain links to the carriers' looking glass websites, when they have one. Is that something we can do? I can certainly do some Googling and provide an initial diff for that page, if desired. Is there a looking glass running on the route servers? Richard ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 27, 2011

Re: Marketing Stuff

by Jay Hanke

On Thu, Sep 22, 2011 at 12:44 PM, Matthew Beckwell <matthewb(a)aitech.net> wrote: > I wouldn't mind working on it. Stretch my artsy-fartsy legs a little bit... > Also--AITech would be happy to take care of having them printed if/whenever needed. Awesome, I think it might be nice to have a list of participants. jay ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 24, 2011

Re: Marketing Stuff

by Matthew Beckwell

I wouldn't mind working on it. Stretch my artsy-fartsy legs a little bit... Also--AITech would be happy to take care of having them printed if/whenever needed. ~Matthew -----Original Message----- From: MICE Discuss [mailto:MICE-DISCUSS@LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET] On Behalf Of Steve Howard Sent: Wednesday, September 21, 2011 9:44 AM To: MICE-DISCUSS(a)LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET Subject: Re: [MICE-DISCUSS] Marketing Stuff Jay, Here is a thing that one of our Marketing guys made several months ago. If anybody would be willing to offer suggestions, we'd be happy to change it. Or, if somebody wants to work on it, we can send it to them. Thanks, Steve On 09/21/2011 08:52 AM, Jay Hanke wrote: > Is someone willing to make up a one page flyer explaining MICE? It > would be handed out at trade shows etc... > > Jay > > ###################################################################### > ## > > To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: > http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1 > > ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1 ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 22, 2011

Re: Remote MICE members?

by Steve Howard

Anthony, Things look good in the MICE switch: Spanning tree enabled protocol rstp Root ID Priority 4096 Address 0019.e254.f340 Cost 2 Port 34 (TenGigabitEthernet0/10) Hello Time 2 sec Max Age 20 sec Forward Delay 15 sec Thanks, Steve On 09/21/2011 06:17 AM, Anthony Anderberg wrote: > > > Frankly, I'm surprised at the outpouring of love for spanning-tree > > > > I don't know anyone that loves spanning-tree, most people > > have more of an abusive older-brother sort of relationship. > > > > I'd lean toward STP being a necessary evil in a L2 environment > > where physical control isn't absolute for all the reasons David > > mentioned. I also like a bunch of the things Andrew brought up, > > but don't have a good feel for what the administration would > > feel like. It seems like I've spent the last 20 years either > > being disappointed in the performance of simple designs or being > > disappointed by the unpredictability of complicated designs... > > > > Anyway, this morning I've changed the main Juniper switch bridge > > priority and it appears to have asserted itself as the root. > > Steve/Jay/Doug - can you guys confirm that things look correct > > on your switches, I'll send you the Juniper's current settings > > off-list. Beyond that we can evolve in the direction the group > > thinks is best. > > > > Cheers, > > Anthony > > > > Anthony Anderberg > > Sr. Systems Analyst > > NU-Telecom > > 320-234-5239 > > anthonyanderberg(a)nu-telecom.net > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: > http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1 > <http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1> > ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: Remote MICE members?

by Doug McIntyre

On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 11:17:35AM +0000, Anthony Anderberg wrote: > Steve/Jay/Doug - can you guys confirm that things look correct > on your switches... The cisco 4506 was setup for portfast/bpdufilter, switching it around would take the one remaining link on it down for a short period. So right now it thinks it is root because there are no other BPDUs allowed into it.. AFAIK, it is going away as soon as SDN switches over/upgrades their link? Probably not worth the disruption at this point in time. -- Doug McIntyre <merlyn(a)iphouse.net> -- ipHouse/Goldengate/Bitstream/ProNS -- Network Engineer/Provisioning/Jack of all Trades ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: Marketing Stuff

by Steve Howard

Jay, Here is a thing that one of our Marketing guys made several months ago. If anybody would be willing to offer suggestions, we'd be happy to change it. Or, if somebody wants to work on it, we can send it to them. Thanks, Steve On 09/21/2011 08:52 AM, Jay Hanke wrote: > Is someone willing to make up a one page flyer explaining MICE? It > would be handed out at trade shows etc... > > Jay > > ######################################################################## > > To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: > http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1 > > ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 21, 2011

Marketing Stuff

by Jay Hanke

Is someone willing to make up a one page flyer explaining MICE? It would be handed out at trade shows etc... Jay ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: Remote MICE members?

by Anthony Anderberg

> Frankly, I'm surprised at the outpouring of love for spanning-tree I don't know anyone that loves spanning-tree, most people have more of an abusive older-brother sort of relationship. I'd lean toward STP being a necessary evil in a L2 environment where physical control isn't absolute for all the reasons David mentioned. I also like a bunch of the things Andrew brought up, but don't have a good feel for what the administration would feel like. It seems like I've spent the last 20 years either being disappointed in the performance of simple designs or being disappointed by the unpredictability of complicated designs... Anyway, this morning I've changed the main Juniper switch bridge priority and it appears to have asserted itself as the root. Steve/Jay/Doug - can you guys confirm that things look correct on your switches, I'll send you the Juniper's current settings off-list. Beyond that we can evolve in the direction the group thinks is best. Cheers, Anthony Anthony Anderberg Sr. Systems Analyst NU-Telecom 320-234-5239 anthonyanderberg(a)nu-telecom.net ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: Remote MICE members?

by Andrew Hoyos

On Sep 20, 2011, at 10:18 PM, David Farmer wrote: > However, you still run spanning-tree to catch mistakes, they will happen and spanning tree will keep them from melting the network. When the network is built and is functioning as designed, spanning-tree has nothing to converge, the network has a loop free topology. In this design, spanning-tree is only there to ensure the network is actually built and actually functioning as designed. I'd somewhat agree here, *but*, there are alternatives to spanning-tree in the IX network - like storm control, limiting to 1 mac addr per port, putting naughty ports in the penalty box (err-disable/shutdown), etc. As an additional comment to my previous e-mail, I don't see issues with spanning-tree as a safety net, but then the proper steps need to be taken on the participant L2 devices to limit the interaction between the STP domains. If we have (I'm assuming) a participant Brocade l2 device acting as the STP root for the IX network, that's an issue that needs to get resolved (ie: bpdufilter towards participant ports, etc). This is an IP exchange, so we really should only be seeing unicast/mcast IP traffic, not layer2 protocols and/or broadcast traffic (save for ARP/ND packets). AMS-IX has some very good guidelines about how to get your layer2 devices to be quiet, located here: http://www.ams-ix.net/config-guide/ ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: Remote MICE members?

by Jay Hanke

>> Can someone take it on to make a design recommendation? > SNIP Spanning tree love-hate Monologue Excellent! I believe you just volunteered to propose a solution! :) Jay ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: Remote MICE members?

by Ryan Goldberg

Forwarded to my team. Nicely put. -----Original Message----- From: MICE Discuss [mailto:MICE-DISCUSS@LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET] On Behalf Of David Farmer Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 10:18 PM To: MICE-DISCUSS(a)LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET Subject: Re: [MICE-DISCUSS] Remote MICE members? On 9/20/11 19:54 CDT, Jay Hanke wrote: > Frankly, I'm surprised at the outpouring of love for spanning-tree on > the list. I've on more than one occasion selected a vendor with a ring > or a virtual chassis technology to avoid spanning-tree in the core. I > was also thrilled at the prospect of something like TRILL. > > Can someone take it on to make a design recommendation? Let me be clear, I don't love spanning-tree at all. But turning off spanning-tree and praying you never have a loop is worse than spanning-tree. My personal design preference is to design your network with a loop free topology at layer2. Then it is possible to run without spanning-tree. Any redundancy is provided using LAGs, GMPLS or MPLS transport technologies, not loops in the bridge topology. However, you still run spanning-tree to catch mistakes, they will happen and spanning tree will keep them from melting the network. When the network is built and is functioning as designed, spanning-tree has nothing to converge, the network has a loop free topology. In this design, spanning-tree is only there to ensure the network is actually built and actually functioning as designed. When you are driving your car, if you see head lights coming at you on the wrong side of the road, most people slow down and get ready to take the ditch. Rather than take a head on into the other guy, or into the ditch, at full speed. In this design, spanning-tree is looking for head light on the wrong side of the road, rather than assuming it will never happen, which is what you are doing if you just turn spanning-tree off. -- =============================================== David Farmer Email:farmer@umn.edu Networking & Telecommunication Services Office of Information Technology University of Minnesota 2218 University Ave SE Phone: 612-626-0815 Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029 Cell: 612-812-9952 =============================================== ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1 ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: Remote MICE members?

by David Farmer

On 9/20/11 19:54 CDT, Jay Hanke wrote: > Frankly, I'm surprised at the outpouring of love for spanning-tree on > the list. I've on more than one occasion selected a vendor with a ring > or a virtual chassis technology to avoid spanning-tree in the core. I > was also thrilled at the prospect of something like TRILL. > > Can someone take it on to make a design recommendation? Let me be clear, I don't love spanning-tree at all. But turning off spanning-tree and praying you never have a loop is worse than spanning-tree. My personal design preference is to design your network with a loop free topology at layer2. Then it is possible to run without spanning-tree. Any redundancy is provided using LAGs, GMPLS or MPLS transport technologies, not loops in the bridge topology. However, you still run spanning-tree to catch mistakes, they will happen and spanning tree will keep them from melting the network. When the network is built and is functioning as designed, spanning-tree has nothing to converge, the network has a loop free topology. In this design, spanning-tree is only there to ensure the network is actually built and actually functioning as designed. When you are driving your car, if you see head lights coming at you on the wrong side of the road, most people slow down and get ready to take the ditch. Rather than take a head on into the other guy, or into the ditch, at full speed. In this design, spanning-tree is looking for head light on the wrong side of the road, rather than assuming it will never happen, which is what you are doing if you just turn spanning-tree off. -- =============================================== David Farmer Email:farmer@umn.edu Networking & Telecommunication Services Office of Information Technology University of Minnesota 2218 University Ave SE Phone: 612-626-0815 Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029 Cell: 612-812-9952 =============================================== ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 21, 2011

Re: Remote MICE members?

by Andrew Hoyos

On Sep 20, 2011, at 7:08 PM, Richard Laager wrote: > I haven't had any cross-vendor problems, even mixing RSTP and MSTP (in > configurations for which they are designed to mix). Same here, at least as it relates to standards based MST/RSTP implementations. Never had issues there. OTOH, when trying to interop between per VLAN STP implementations (like RPVST+/Cisco, and VSTP/Juniper type scenarios), things *do* get a bit dicey. ######################################################################## To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

Sept. 21, 2011