- mice-discuss - lists.micemn.net

US Internet (AS 10242) - Router Maintenance
by Justin Krejci July 22, 2022

July 22, 2022

US Internet will be dropping IX BGP sessions to complete a router reboot for software updates. BGP sessions will be re-established after reboot is completed. The maintenance window of time for this starts this evening 11pm central time. US Internet at MICE ASN: 10242 206.108.255.19 2001:504:27::2802:0:1 Justin Krejci Network Engineer 952.253.3200 12450 Wayzata Blvd. Suite 320 | Minnetonka, MN 55305 [1616694896307]

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Customer reports on Netflix issues
by Frank Bulk July 21, 2022

July 21, 2022

Last night and into this morning we've received several customer reports about being unable to watch Netflix video. Our own Netflix cache shows some kind of event Wednesday at ~4:20 pm U.S. Central where IPv6 traffic to it dropped to zero and there was a huge drop in IPv4 traffic. Currently traffic volume this morning is just under half of normal. Interestingly enough, MICE's own two port channels to Netflix (image attached) are showing ~57% of yesterday's volume at this time (29.3 Gbps rather than 51.15 Gbps). I opened a ticket with Netflix through the Netflix cache administration portal, but wondering if anyone is receiving similar reports from customers or is aware of anything else? Regards, Frank Bulk FiberNet Communications

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4/18/2022 and 5/24/2022 Board Meetings
by AnthonyAnderberg＠nuvera.net July 19, 2022

July 19, 2022

As promised here are my notes from the last two MICE board meetings, combined since the topics were the same for both. 4/18/2022 and 5/24/2022 MICE Board Meetings Conducted via Phone Bridges, Directors in Attendance: Richard Laager, Anthony Anderberg, Reid Fishler Capital Credits and other Co-op Items We are a 501.c12 entity instead of the more typical 501.c6 so several members accrued capital credits for 2012-2016 because of their contributions. We're under no obligation to pay them. When determining how to handle the retroactive 501c12 years, Richard and Kayla previously combined 2012-2016 as if they were one year for capital credit purposes. The accountants disagreed with that approach. They said we have to recalculate it year-by-year, with different treatment of the years with losses. The accountants would prefer a large correction in the 2021 books instead of re-opening 2012-2020 books. Richard proposed that we pay out capital credits for all of the years prior to 2017 to close those years out completely. The year 2017 was when we started collecting port fees. More recent donations and donations going forward are accounted as good will, and the board discussed that we would probably be better off re-opening the books for the years 2012-2016 and reclassifying donations in those years as good-will also. This would be extra work for the accountants but would solve the capital credit pay-out issue - additionally it was felt that paying out capital credits would harm our case should we ever need to go back to the IRS in an effort to be reclassified as a 501.c3 organization. The board also talked about the possibility of needing to notify members each year of their capital credit status/amount. We also discussed the best way to pay out capital credits, either as separate checks or as credits on annual bills. After some discussion it was felt that the benefit of less-paperwork was off-set by the effort required to explain variable annual bills, additionally 1099 statements would likely be required in either case. Research on all of the above continues. Epik / IP Volume Non-Pay Disconnect The board decided to expel Epik as a member for 1) non-payment, and 2) failure to ever provide updated corporate information for their IP Volume entity. They were given notice as required by the bylaws, that notice period has now expired, and they have been disconnected. KC Remote Switch Proposal The board discussed the proposal for a remote switch in Kansas City, with most of the specific pros and cons also being discussed and well documented on the MICE-DISCUSS list. It was agreed that this is an evolving topic that will need more discussion and thought by the community as a whole. After the inclusion of expected members the revised proposal was approved with directors Anderberg and Fishler voting yes and director Laager voting no. The board also discussed several other items that will be made public at a later date. Respectfully Submitted, Anthony Anderberg MICE Treasurer/Secretary

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Last day for free MWPS 2022 registration
by Jay Hanke July 15, 2022

July 15, 2022

Today is the last day of free attendee registration for the Midwest Peering Summit. After today, the registration will be $40 per person either in advance or at the door. We currently have over 160 registered attendees making it the largest MICE meeting ever! Our room block at the hotel has sold out but there are a handful of rooms left at the hotel. We have a good mix of CDN, Eyeball, Vendors, R&E and IX operators attending. https://www.eventcreate.com/e/mwps2022 Special thanks to our sponsors! 1623 Farnam Arista Aureon616 Bluebird Datacenters NocIX South Front Networks -- Jay Hanke, President South Front Networks jayhanke(a)southfront.io Phone 612-204-0000

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Please welcome hkgo LLC to MICE!
by Jeremy Lumby July 1, 2022

July 1, 2022

Name: hkgo LLC Switch: MN VoIP Port: E 35 ASN: 945 IPv4: 206.108.255.197/24 IPv6: 2001:504:27:0:0:3B1::1/64 Peering Contact: peering(a)august.tw Route Servers: YES BFD: YES Welcome Aboard! Jeremy Lumby Minnesota VoIP 9217 17th Ave S #216 Bloomington, MN 55425 Main: 612-355-7740 Direct: 612-392-6814 Fax: 952-873-7425 jlumby(a)mnvoip.com

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Please welcome ANSIBLE Networks to MICE!
by Jeremy Lumby June 22, 2022

June 22, 2022

Name: ANSIBLE Networks Switch: MN VoIP Port: E 14 ASN: 14570 IPv4: 206.108.255.196/24 IPv6: 2001:504:27:0:0:38EA::1/64 Peering Contact: peering(a)ansible.org Route Servers: YES BFD: NO Welcome Aboard! Jeremy Lumby Minnesota VoIP 9217 17th Ave S #216 Bloomington, MN 55425 Main: 612-355-7740 Direct: 612-392-6814 Fax: 952-873-7425 jlumby(a)mnvoip.com

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LibertyCommunications Port Move
by Jay Hanke June 1, 2022

June 1, 2022

Liberty Communications has moved to port 7/1 on the SFN100G remote. This is the last member connection on the SFN 10G remote switch. The 10G switch can be removed from monitoring -- Jay Hanke, President South Front Networks jayhanke(a)southfront.io Phone 612-204-0000

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ClaimLynx disconnecting from MICE
by Thomas Johnson May 25, 2022

May 25, 2022

Effective tomorrow (5/25/22) afternoon at 15:00CT, ClaimLynx will be disconnecting from MICE. Thank you for all of the prefixes, and the effort that has gone into making such a great exchange. Best, Thomas Johnson ClaimLynx, Inc. -- This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you are not the intended recipient or the individual responsible for delivering the e-mail to the intended recipient, please be advised that you have received this e-mail in error and that any use, dissemination, forwarding, printing, or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please return it to the sender immediately and delete the original message and any copy of it from your computer system. If you have any questions concerning this message, please contact the sender or call ClaimLynx at (952) 593-5969.

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Please welcome Flexnetworks to MICE!
by Jeremy Lumby May 24, 2022

May 24, 2022

Name: Flexnetworks Switch: MICE Core Port: E 4/23 ASN: 19523 IPv4: 206.108.255.194/24 IPv6: 2001:504:27:0:0:4C43::1/64 Peering Contact: support(a)flexnetworks.ca Route Servers: YES BFD: NO Welcome Aboard! Jeremy Lumby Minnesota VoIP 9217 17th Ave S #216 Bloomington, MN 55425 Main: 612-355-7740 Direct: 612-392-6814 Fax: 952-873-7425 jlumby(a)mnvoip.com

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Re: Apple peering down
by AnthonyAnderberg＠nuvera.net May 23, 2022

May 23, 2022

Looks like MICE’s LAG Po30 to Apple went down at the same time - about 3:15am this morning. From: MICE Discuss <MICE-DISCUSS(a)LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET> on behalf of Frank Bulk <fbulk(a)MYPREMIERONLINE.COM> Reply-To: MICE Discuss <MICE-DISCUSS(a)LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET> Date: Friday, May 20, 2022 at 8:48 AM To: MICE Discuss <MICE-DISCUSS(a)LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET> Subject: [MICE-DISCUSS] Apple peering down Anyone else seeing Apple peer down over IPv4 and IPv6 since 3:18 am? May 20 03:18:10 207.32.15.14 (sxct-north-2.sxcy.fbnt.netins.net) SiouxCity-Fibernet-Arista Rib: %BGP-3-NOTIFICATION: sent to neighbor 2001:504:27::2ca:0:1 (AS714-1.micemn.net) (AS 714 APPLE-ENGINEERING, US) 4/0 (Hold Timer Expired Error/Unspecified) 0 bytes May 20 03:18:10 207.32.15.14 (sxct-north-2.sxcy.fbnt.netins.net) SiouxCity-Fibernet-Arista Rib: %BGP-5-ADJCHANGE: peer 2001:504:27::2ca:0:1 (AS714-1.micemn.net) (AS 714 APPLE-ENGINEERING, US) old state Established event HoldTime new state Idle May 20 03:18:10 207.32.15.14 (sxct-north-2.sxcy.fbnt.netins.net) SiouxCity-Fibernet-Arista Rib: %BGP-3-NOTIFICATION: sent to neighbor 206.108.255.146 (AS714-1.micemn.net) (AS 714 APPLE-ENGINEERING, US) 4/0 (Hold Timer Expired Error/Unspecified) 0 bytes May 20 03:18:10 207.32.15.14 (sxct-north-2.sxcy.fbnt.netins.net) SiouxCity-Fibernet-Arista Rib: %BGP-5-ADJCHANGE: peer 206.108.255.146 (AS714-1.micemn.net) (AS 714 APPLE-ENGINEERING, US) old state Established event HoldTime new state Idle Fran k ________________________________ To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

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Please welcome Communications 1 Network to MICE!
by Jeremy Lumby May 20, 2022

May 20, 2022

Name: Communications 1 Network Switch: SouthFront Albert Lea Port: E 7/4 ASN: 394911 IPv4: 206.108.255.195/24 IPv6: 2001:504:27:0:6:69F::1/64 Peering Contact: jkeiper(a)comm1net.net Route Servers: YES BFD: YES Welcome Aboard! Jeremy Lumby Minnesota VoIP 9217 17th Ave S #216 Bloomington, MN 55425 Main: 612-355-7740 Direct: 612-392-6814 Fax: 952-873-7425 jlumby(a)mnvoip.com

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Apple peering down
by Frank Bulk May 20, 2022

May 20, 2022

Anyone else seeing Apple peer down over IPv4 and IPv6 since 3:18 am? May 20 03:18:10 207.32.15.14 (sxct-north-2.sxcy.fbnt.netins.net) SiouxCity-Fibernet-Arista Rib: %BGP-3-NOTIFICATION: sent to neighbor 2001:504:27::2ca:0:1 (AS714-1.micemn.net) (AS 714 APPLE-ENGINEERING, US) 4/0 (Hold Timer Expired Error/Unspecified) 0 bytes May 20 03:18:10 207.32.15.14 (sxct-north-2.sxcy.fbnt.netins.net) SiouxCity-Fibernet-Arista Rib: %BGP-5-ADJCHANGE: peer 2001:504:27::2ca:0:1 (AS714-1.micemn.net) (AS 714 APPLE-ENGINEERING, US) old state Established event HoldTime new state Idle May 20 03:18:10 207.32.15.14 (sxct-north-2.sxcy.fbnt.netins.net) SiouxCity-Fibernet-Arista Rib: %BGP-3-NOTIFICATION: sent to neighbor 206.108.255.146 (AS714-1.micemn.net) (AS 714 APPLE-ENGINEERING, US) 4/0 (Hold Timer Expired Error/Unspecified) 0 bytes May 20 03:18:10 207.32.15.14 (sxct-north-2.sxcy.fbnt.netins.net) SiouxCity-Fibernet-Arista Rib: %BGP-5-ADJCHANGE: peer 206.108.255.146 (AS714-1.micemn.net) (AS 714 APPLE-ENGINEERING, US) old state Established event HoldTime new state Idle Fran k

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Please welcome Bluepeak to MICE!
by Jeremy Lumby May 11, 2022

May 11, 2022

Name: Bluepeak Switch: MICE Core Port: E6/23/1 ASN: 20412 IPv4: This is a port upgrade and name change from Vast Broadband, all IP info remains the same. The new connection will be 100G IPv6: Peering Contact: neteng(a)mybluepeak.com Route Servers: Yes BFD: Yes Welcome Aboard Again! Jeremy Lumby Minnesota VoIP 9217 17th Ave S #216 Bloomington, MN 55425 Main: 612-355-7740 Direct: 612-392-6814 Fax: 952-873-7425 jlumby(a)mnvoip.com

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Midwest Peering Summit 2022 Update
by Jay Hanke May 9, 2022

May 9, 2022

As of last night, we have 80 attendees registered for the summer event. The event is free of charge to peering networks (or potentially peering networks). Pre Registration is required. You can register here: https://www.eventcreate.com/e/mwps2022 This is our discounted room block: https://reservations.travelclick.com/109230?groupID=3466891 We ask if your company is bringing sales folks that you purchase a table ($200) to help with costs. MWPS 2022 Sponsors/Exhibitors ------------------------------------ 1623 Farnam Arista Aureon 616 Bluebird Networks NocIX South Front Networks MWPS 2022 Exhibitors ------------------------------------ Aurora Fiber Optic Networks Great Plains Communications Heartland Technology Data Center Hurricane Electric Precision Group US Internet Vantage Point Solutions IX Attendees ------------------------------------ ChIX (Chicago IL) DesMoinesIX (Des Moines IA) Fiber Data Internet Exchange (Altoona, Indy, STL) KCIX (Kansas City MO) MICE (Minneapolis MN) OhioIX (Columbus OH) OmahaIX (Omaha NE) QCIX (Davenport) SiouxIX (Sioux City IA) SpringIX (Springfield MO) STLIX (St Louis MO) Attending Companies ------------------------------------ Amazon Prime Video ConnectDSM Fiber Minnesota FiberComm Involta Iowa Communication Network Google Fiber Key Cooperative Liberty Communications Mankato Networks Midco MTC Technologies MTC Communications (not the same) Ninja-IX Nuvera Optk OzarksGo RLM Underground SDN Communications Smartsource Consulting South Slope Cooperative Communications Stream Data Centers SupraNet Communications Unite Private Networks Vaultas WIN Winnebago Cooperative Telecom Association -- Jay Hanke, President South Front Networks jayhanke(a)southfront.io Phone 612-204-0000

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MICE Remote Switch Policy
by Richard Laager May 6, 2022

May 6, 2022

I've had some discussions with the board as well as with Jay and Jeremy on these topics. The board consensus was to bring this (in general) to the membership for more input. As to the specifics, while I know others agree with at least parts of this, I'm only speaking for myself here. I'll let everyone articulate their own positions. (This disclaimer should not be read as me signaling the existance of disagreement either. I just don't want to put words in other people's mouths.) Our current policy on remote switches is here: https://micemn.net/technical.html#remotes It has the proposal presented to the membership for discussion, then the board makes a final decision. Is this decision ministerial or discretionary? That is, if the remote switch proposal checks all the boxes in our policy, is MICE "required" (supposed to) always grant it, or is the board supposed to apply some discretion? If the decision is ministerial, then why bother bringing this to the board (or for that matter, the members) all? Couldn't we save a bunch of time and hassle and simply have management (in some form, whether that's me, Jay, and/or Jeremy) approve it? If the decision is discretionary, are there particular criteria that the board should consider (above and beyond the listed criteria)? One criteria used in a discussion I had (and I can't recall which of us said it first) is "MICE's strategic interests". What would that phrase mean to you; what are some strategic interests of MICE? For a bit of an absurd example for the thought experiment, imagine that someone was proposing a MICE remote switch, but we knew their goal was to attract a bunch of members and then convert that into a competing exchange. Is that something we would have to agree to simply because they met all the objective criteria? When we were new and little, MICE certainly had an interest in making every decision in a way that would maximize additional peering. However, at this point, the calculus may be (I'd argue is) different. We are moving a lot of traffic and are important to our members / in our region. We have to be careful that our decisions do not destabilize the exchange--in multiple ways: technical, financial, or political. Either way, should we expand the list of objective criteria in the policy? Some examples: * We have previously discussed dedicated vs non-dedicated switches. As time goes along, I am more convinced than ever that MICE remote switches should be required to be dedicated. Non-dedicated switches present extra complications for configuration and troubleshooting. (Jeremy has some additional insight on this that he will share.) I think we should make it a requirement that the switch be dedicated. (Perhaps the board could still grant an exception in exceptional cases.) * Should we require that a remote switch have X number of participants committed? And if so, what is X? In my view, it hardly makes sense to have a remote switch one or two participants. They could just as well backhaul to MICE directly. The criteria for allowing new remote switches vs disconnecting existing remotes need not be the same. If we set a minimum of e.g. 5 participants, we don't necessarily need to disconnect existing remotes that don't meet that. And I think the consensus is that we would not, barring them creating some significant problem. How do we feel about far-away remote switches? (This is a live issue in the context of the proposed Kansas City remote.) Some concerns: * At Wiktel, I peer with MN VoIP's far away extensions in Minneapolis. For example, I peer at SeattleIX (SIX) in Minneapolis. This has caused me some issues. For example, latency-sensitive gaming traffic was tromboning Wiktel-Minneapolis-Seattle-Chicago-Seattle-Minneapolis-Wiktel rather than Wiktel-Chicago-Wiktel. * Is it safe to have a broadcast domain that stretches across multiple states (or half a continent, in the SIX case)? * If we take this to its logical extreme... Imagine we had a MICE extension in every datacenter in the U.S. I think that is pretty obviously untenable for a bunch of reasons. Something close to that is actually within the realm of possibility, with some of these virtual extension things that people are doing. (Reid would be able to cite who.) Granted, nobody is proposing that today, but where should we draw the line? * Far-away extensions may reduce the incentive for CDNs to install locally. Some counterpoints: * Nobody is forcing networks to use the far-away remotes. * If people choose to use them, they take their routing into their own hands. They need to understand the tromboning risk and set their own routing policy. o Counter-counterpoint: Do they? Especially smaller / less experienced networks? Have we adequately warned them? o Counter-counterpoint: The existence of these far-away peers doesn't affect just them. It also affects the other networks with which they peer. Everyone on the exchange needs to be aware of the existence of far-away participants and handle their routing policy accordingly. If there are enough far-away peers, this might tip networks into an opt-in route server policy, or even to only do bilaterals. This will disadvantage small participants. * Networks can backhaul into far-away exchanges directly. o Counter-counterpoint: But a remote switch makes this cheaper / more feasible / more common, which is literally the point of creating such a remote switch. * For a local eyeball network in Des Moines, neither MICE nor Kansas City are far-away from me. Even MICE via Kansas City is not likely to be problematic. This might be the only economically feasible way they could peer with Minneapolis content. -- Richard

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MICE Node for AS112
by David Farmer May 5, 2022

May 5, 2022

I'm seeing IPv6 routes from the MICE Node for AS112, but not IPv4 routes This is what the MICE Looking Glass sees; micemn-lg>sh bgp regexp _112_ BGP table version is 103138859, local router ID is 206.108.255.250 Status codes: s suppressed, d damped, h history, * valid, > best, i - internal, r RIB-failure, S Stale, m multipath, b backup-path, f RT-Filter, x best-external, a additional-path, c RIB-compressed, Origin codes: i - IGP, e - EGP, ? - incomplete RPKI validation codes: V valid, I invalid, N Not found Network Next Hop Metric LocPrf Weight Path * 192.31.196.0 206.108.255.52 255 0 6939 112 i *> 206.108.255.52 255 0 6939 112 i * 192.175.48.0 206.108.255.52 255 0 6939 112 i *> 206.108.255.52 255 0 6939 112 i micemn-lg>sh bgp ipv6 uni regexp _112_ BGP table version is 165890313, local router ID is 206.108.255.250 Status codes: s suppressed, d damped, h history, * valid, > best, i - internal, r RIB-failure, S Stale, m multipath, b backup-path, f RT-Filter, x best-external, a additional-path, c RIB-compressed, Origin codes: i - IGP, e - EGP, ? - incomplete RPKI validation codes: V valid, I invalid, N Not found Network Next Hop Metric LocPrf Weight Path *> 2001:4:112::/48 2001:504:27::70:0:1 0 112 i * 2001:504:27::70:0:1 0 112 i *> 2620:4F:8000::/48 2001:504:27::70:0:1 0 112 i * 2001:504:27::70:0:1 0 112 i micemn-lg> -- =============================================== David Farmer Email:farmer@umn.edu Networking & Telecommunication Services Office of Information Technology University of Minnesota 2218 University Ave SE Phone: 612-626-0815 Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029 Cell: 612-812-9952 ===============================================

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Please welcome LTD Broadband. to MICE!
by Jeremy Lumby May 3, 2022

May 3, 2022

Name: LTD Broadband Switch: South Front Networks Albert Lea Port: E9/1 ASN: 394330 IPv4: This is a port upgrade/move, all IP info remains the same. The new connection will be 100G IPv6: Peering Contact: coreyhauer(a)ltdbroadband.com Route Servers: No BFD: No Welcome Aboard Again! Jeremy Lumby Minnesota VoIP 9217 17th Ave S #216 Bloomington, MN 55425 Main: 612-355-7740 Direct: 612-392-6814 Fax: 952-873-7425 jlumby(a)mnvoip.com

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IPv4 BGP session to Google down
by Frank Bulk April 19, 2022

April 19, 2022

Our BGP session bounce several times last might between 10:00 and 10:07 pm Central, and then has been down from 10:21 am. Anyone else seeing this? I see a little drop in the graph (http://micelg.usinternet.com/cacti/graph_view.php?action=tree&tree_id=1&lea…) this morning. Frank Bulk FiberNet (AS18883) Apr 7 10:21:55 207.32.15.14 Rib: %BGP-3-NOTIFICATION: sent to neighbor 206.108.255.167 (AS 15169) 4/0 (Hold Timer Expired Error/Unspecified) 0 bytes Apr 7 10:21:55 207.32.15.14 Rib: %BGP-5-ADJCHANGE: peer 206.108.255.167 (AS 15169) old state Established event HoldTime new state Idle Apr 7 10:22:00 207.32.15.14 Rib: %BGP-5-ADJCHANGE: peer 206.108.255.167 (AS 15169) old state OpenConfirm event RecvKeepAlive new state Established Apr 7 10:22:30 207.32.15.14 Rib: %BGP-5-ADJCHANGE: peer 206.108.255.167 (AS 15169) old state Established event HoldTime new state Idle

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Please welcome Nsight Telservices to MICE!
by Jeremy Lumby April 18, 2022

April 18, 2022

Name: Nsight Telservices Switch: MICE Core Port: E 6/22/1 ASN: 3663 IPv4: 206.108.255.192/24 IPv6: 2001:504:27:0:0:E4F::1/64 Peering Contact: network-routing(a)nsight.com Route Servers: YES BFD: YES Welcome Aboard! Jeremy Lumby Minnesota VoIP 9217 17th Ave S #216 Bloomington, MN 55425 Main: 612-355-7740 Direct: 612-392-6814 Fax: 952-873-7425 jlumby(a)mnvoip.com

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OT: NANOG call for presentations
by steve ulrich April 5, 2022

April 5, 2022

folks - long time lurker here. ( as well as a couple of times meatspace meeting attendee. ) apologies in advance for the off-topic email, but i'm on the NANOG program committee and we've had folks express interest in presentations regarding regional peering exchanges as well as talks regarding independent networks that have done interesting things from an operational perspective. e.g.: managing growth, novel deployment of access technologies. etc. it struck me that the folks peering at MICE or engaged in MICE operations might have great presentation ideas/material.. the next NANOG is in june in montreal, ca. but we're always looking for presentations for future NANOGs as well. NANOG has a variety of different presentation formats and we're open to suggestions. please feel free to submit an abstract online ( https://nanog.org/program/call-presentations/) and someone from the program committee thanks! -- steve ulrich (sulrich(a)botwerks.org)

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Please welcome Long Lines Broadband to MICE!
by Jeremy Lumby April 4, 2022

April 4, 2022

Name: Long Lines Broadband Switch: MICE Main Port: E6/21/1 ASN: 32867 IPv4: This is a port upgrade, all IP info remains the same. The new connection will be 100G IPv6: Peering Contact: data(a)longlines.biz Route Servers: Yes BFD: No Welcome Aboard Again! Jeremy Lumby Minnesota VoIP 9217 17th Ave S #216 Bloomington, MN 55425 Main: 612-355-7740 Direct: 612-392-6814 Fax: 952-873-7425 jlumby(a)mnvoip.com

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ARIN NOAUTH
by Jay Hanke April 4, 2022

April 4, 2022

ARIN NOAUTH (legacy IRR) is getting shut down today at 11 AM central time. There will likely be some filtering issues across the internet for networks that haven't updated their IRR. https://www.arin.net/blog/2022/02/16/Take-Action-Now-to-Prepare-for-the-ARI… -- Jay Hanke, President South Front Networks jayhanke(a)southfront.io Phone 612-204-0000

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MICE RS3 deactivated
by Jay Hanke March 31, 2022

March 31, 2022

MICE RS3 (test route server) has been powered down. Thanks! -- Jay Hanke, President South Front Networks jayhanke(a)southfront.io Phone 612-204-0000

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Re: MICE Remote Switch Policy
by Dean Bahls March 24, 2022

March 24, 2022

I don’t think we can create enough check boxes to protect against all combinations and permutations that nefarious folks can dream up….that’s why we have a board. I think the board is elected to make sure the exchange is being run properly….and that’s how I vote. If the board wants feedback on any of the topics below, I’m sure all of us have opinions, and that would probably provide guidance needed for the board to make an official ruling. All within the realm of reasonableness. Keep up the good work! Dean From: MICE Discuss <MICE-DISCUSS(a)LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET<mailto:MICE-DISCUSS@LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET>> On Behalf Of Richard Laager Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2022 3:59 PM To: MICE-DISCUSS(a)LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET<mailto:MICE-DISCUSS@LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET> Subject: [MICE-DISCUSS] MICE Remote Switch Policy I've had some discussions with the board as well as with Jay and Jeremy on these topics. The board consensus was to bring this (in general) to the membership for more input. As to the specifics, while I know others agree with at least parts of this, I'm only speaking for myself here. I'll let everyone articulate their own positions. (This disclaimer should not be read as me signaling the existance of disagreement either. I just don't want to put words in other people's mouths.) Our current policy on remote switches is here: https://micemn.net/technical.html#remotes It has the proposal presented to the membership for discussion, then the board makes a final decision. Is this decision ministerial or discretionary? That is, if the remote switch proposal checks all the boxes in our policy, is MICE "required" (supposed to) always grant it, or is the board supposed to apply some discretion? If the decision is ministerial, then why bother bringing this to the board (or for that matter, the members) all? Couldn't we save a bunch of time and hassle and simply have management (in some form, whether that's me, Jay, and/or Jeremy) approve it? If the decision is discretionary, are there particular criteria that the board should consider (above and beyond the listed criteria)? One criteria used in a discussion I had (and I can't recall which of us said it first) is "MICE's strategic interests". What would that phrase mean to you; what are some strategic interests of MICE? For a bit of an absurd example for the thought experiment, imagine that someone was proposing a MICE remote switch, but we knew their goal was to attract a bunch of members and then convert that into a competing exchange. Is that something we would have to agree to simply because they met all the objective criteria? When we were new and little, MICE certainly had an interest in making every decision in a way that would maximize additional peering. However, at this point, the calculus may be (I'd argue is) different. We are moving a lot of traffic and are important to our members / in our region. We have to be careful that our decisions do not destabilize the exchange--in multiple ways: technical, financial, or political. Either way, should we expand the list of objective criteria in the policy? Some examples: * We have previously discussed dedicated vs non-dedicated switches. As time goes along, I am more convinced than ever that MICE remote switches should be required to be dedicated. Non-dedicated switches present extra complications for configuration and troubleshooting. (Jeremy has some additional insight on this that he will share.) I think we should make it a requirement that the switch be dedicated. (Perhaps the board could still grant an exception in exceptional cases.) * Should we require that a remote switch have X number of participants committed? And if so, what is X? In my view, it hardly makes sense to have a remote switch one or two participants. They could just as well backhaul to MICE directly. The criteria for allowing new remote switches vs disconnecting existing remotes need not be the same. If we set a minimum of e.g. 5 participants, we don't necessarily need to disconnect existing remotes that don't meet that. And I think the consensus is that we would not, barring them creating some significant problem. How do we feel about far-away remote switches? (This is a live issue in the context of the proposed Kansas City remote.) Some concerns: * At Wiktel, I peer with MN VoIP's far away extensions in Minneapolis. For example, I peer at SeattleIX (SIX) in Minneapolis. This has caused me some issues. For example, latency-sensitive gaming traffic was tromboning Wiktel-Minneapolis-Seattle-Chicago-Seattle-Minneapolis-Wiktel rather than Wiktel-Chicago-Wiktel. * Is it safe to have a broadcast domain that stretches across multiple states (or half a continent, in the SIX case)? * If we take this to its logical extreme... Imagine we had a MICE extension in every datacenter in the U.S. I think that is pretty obviously untenable for a bunch of reasons. Something close to that is actually within the realm of possibility, with some of these virtual extension things that people are doing. (Reid would be able to cite who.) Granted, nobody is proposing that today, but where should we draw the line? * Far-away extensions may reduce the incentive for CDNs to install locally. Some counterpoints: * Nobody is forcing networks to use the far-away remotes. * If people choose to use them, they take their routing into their own hands. They need to understand the tromboning risk and set their own routing policy. * Counter-counterpoint: Do they? Especially smaller / less experienced networks? Have we adequately warned them? * Counter-counterpoint: The existence of these far-away peers doesn't affect just them. It also affects the other networks with which they peer. Everyone on the exchange needs to be aware of the existence of far-away participants and handle their routing policy accordingly. If there are enough far-away peers, this might tip networks into an opt-in route server policy, or even to only do bilaterals. This will disadvantage small participants. * Networks can backhaul into far-away exchanges directly. * Counter-counterpoint: But a remote switch makes this cheaper / more feasible / more common, which is literally the point of creating such a remote switch. * For a local eyeball network in Des Moines, neither MICE nor Kansas City are far-away from me. Even MICE via Kansas City is not likely to be problematic. This might be the only economically feasible way they could peer with Minneapolis content. -- Richard ________________________________ To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

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icmp v6 nd storm ~ 00:58:01 2022/03/18 GMT?
by Michael Hare March 24, 2022

March 24, 2022

I presume I wasn't the only one that felt the arp/nd storm that began ~ 00:58:01 2022/03/18 GMT? Event stopped for us by 01:03:02. I don't have info about mac addrs but our peering device reported 20kpps of icmp neighbor discovery. -Michael [AS3128]

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Corrected Room Code for Summer Meeting
by Jay Hanke March 23, 2022

March 23, 2022

The hotel fixed the booking issue with the block of rooms. The code is now working correctly. Here is a shortcut to the link, you can book one or two nights at the discounted rate. https://reservations.travelclick.com/109230?groupID=3466891 Also to attend you need to register in advance. https://www.eventcreate.com/e/mwps2022 Thanks! -- Jay Hanke, President South Front Networks jayhanke(a)southfront.io Phone 612-204-0000

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Re: MAC Address Filtering
by AnthonyAnderberg＠nuvera.net March 23, 2022

March 23, 2022

I’m going to be in tonight working on MOPs of my own, contact me off-list and we can talk about timing. Cheers, Anthony From: MICE Discuss <MICE-DISCUSS(a)LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET> on behalf of Larry Larsen <llarsen(a)LONGLINES.BIZ> Reply-To: MICE Discuss <MICE-DISCUSS(a)LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET> Date: Wednesday, March 23, 2022 at 3:19 PM To: MICE Discuss <MICE-DISCUSS(a)LISTS.IPHOUSE.NET> Subject: [MICE-DISCUSS] MAC Address Filtering Good Afternoon; We are going to be swapping out a router this evening at 511, and if I remember correctly you have a MAC Address filter on your connections. Who do we need to work with to get the new MAC addresses authorized? Thank you! [cid:image001.png@01D83EC9.8E076EB0] Larry L. Larsen Director of Information Technology Phone: 712.271.5920 Email: llarsen(a)longlines.biz<mailto:llarsen@longlines.biz> 504 4th Street Sergeant Bluff, IA 51054 https://www.longlines.com/ [Title: Facebook - Description: image of Facebook icon]<https://www.facebook.com/LongLines/> [Title: LinkedIn - Description: image of LinkedIn icon] <https://www.linkedin.com/company/long-lines> [Title: Twitter - Description: image of Twitter icon] <https://twitter.com/LongLinesBB> ________________________________ To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

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MAC Address Filtering
by Larry Larsen March 23, 2022

March 23, 2022

Good Afternoon; We are going to be swapping out a router this evening at 511, and if I remember correctly you have a MAC Address filter on your connections. Who do we need to work with to get the new MAC addresses authorized? Thank you! [cid:image001.png@01D83EC9.4D210D70] Larry L. Larsen Director of Information Technology Phone: 712.271.5920 Email: llarsen(a)longlines.biz<mailto:llarsen@longlines.biz> 504 4th Street Sergeant Bluff, IA 51054 https://www.longlines.com/ [Title: Facebook - Description: image of Facebook icon]<https://www.facebook.com/LongLines/> [Title: LinkedIn - Description: image of LinkedIn icon] <https://www.linkedin.com/company/long-lines> [Title: Twitter - Description: image of Twitter icon] <https://twitter.com/LongLinesBB>

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Midwest Peering Summit Info July 26, 2022
by Jay Hanke March 21, 2022

March 21, 2022

As part of the MICE Summer outreach meeting. We have set up a Peering Summit with a number of neighboring Internet Exchanges. These include OmahaIX, KCIX, QCIX and several others. Each of the involved IXes will be attending and assisting in marketing the event to their users. Here's the link to the registration for the conference. https://www.eventcreate.com/e/mwps2022 Advanced registration is free for peering networks. We'll encounter an extra fee from the venue for attendees not pre registered. We'd ask that you pick up a table if you're going to bring sales folks. We have a block of rooms reserved with a discount at the hotel for rooms from the 25th through the 27th of July at $95 per night. Log into: https://www.stoneycreekhotels.com/ Click book now Des Moines Discount Code: 2207SOUTHF Thanks! -- Jay Hanke, President South Front Networks jayhanke(a)southfront.io Phone 612-204-0000

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MICE Secretary
by Richard Laager March 19, 2022

March 19, 2022

This is going to MICE-ANNOUNCE too, in this interest of formalities. After the UG 40 meeting on March 11, the MICE board appointed Anthony Anderberg as Secretary. (This is separate from the Treasurer appointment which happened earlier and was mentioned during the meeting.) -- Richard

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Netnod Down?
by David Farmer March 19, 2022

March 19, 2022

Is Netnod down at MICE? I'm not seeing any routes from them, at least via the route servers. Thanks -- =============================================== David Farmer Email:farmer@umn.edu Networking & Telecommunication Services Office of Information Technology University of Minnesota 2218 University Ave SE Phone: 612-626-0815 Minneapolis, MN 55414-3029 Cell: 612-812-9952 ===============================================

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MICE Social
by Richard Laager March 16, 2022

March 16, 2022

With the meeting reschedule, we kinda tossed around the idea of a MICE Social. I’d imagine this would be going out to supper, similar to how we do after in person meetings. Is anyone interested in getting together tomorrow (Wednesday)? I am at the Hyatt Regency for MTA, but am open to various locations. -- Richard

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Board Minutes
by Jeremy Lumby March 15, 2022

March 15, 2022

Since we did not have much open discussion time at the end of today's meeting, I wanted to propose a change for the procedure that the board follows. I propose that the board start taking, and publishing minutes from board meetings. This would allow the membership to see how the board members were voting/representing their interests. It would also be invaluable information for the voting members to have in the event that we ever had a contested election again. Jeremy Lumby Minnesota VoIP 9217 17th Ave S #216 Bloomington, MN 55425 M: 612-355-7740 D: 612-392-6814 F: 952-873-7425 jlumby(a)mnvoip.com

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Re: MICE marketing
by Richard Laager March 15, 2022

March 15, 2022

We are in the process of converting to IXP Manager. Will that provide the data you need? If so, then it’s not likely worth fiddling with much more now. If IXP Manager won’t provide the data, then it sounds like we should add the average to the graph? -- Richard > On Mar 11, 2022, at 22:50, Bill Woodcock <woody(a)pch.net> wrote: > > > >> On Mar 12, 2022, at 3:53 AM, Richard Laager <rlaager(a)wiktel.com> wrote: >> >> https://www.pch.net/ixp/dir lists "Midwest Internet Cooperative Exchange" as having an average of 1K of traffic. > > Ah, you changed your traffic graph URL. I’ve updated to your new URL, and the new numbers should be reflected immediately. Also, the graph you produce doesn’t show your average (which is the only economically-significant number), and we’re in the process of rewriting our code (which broke) that calculates average values from graph bitmaps, and if you’re making your raw data available, we don’t have a URL for it… Everything goes smoothest when we can pull raw data rather than scraping from the bitmap. With 800 IXPs to collect data from every day, the ones that are fully automated scale well, but the ones that require a human being to go do something don’t scale well for us, since we’re only about twenty people. > > -Bill >

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MICE marketing
by Miles McCredie March 14, 2022

March 14, 2022

One other comment on the marketing side - It would be handy to have PCH update https://www.pch.net/ixp/dir#!mt-filters=%7B%22ctry%22%3A%5B%22dropdown%22%2…. I received a snarky comment from someone about the 1Kbps average traffic that they are showing. [http://images.midcocomm.com/ES_MidcoLogo.png] Miles McCredie Network Engineer - Architect Office: 6052755192 Miles.McCredie(a)midco.com Midco.com

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Please welcome StackPath to MICE!
by Jeremy Lumby March 12, 2022

March 12, 2022

Name: StackPath Switch: MICE Core Port: 3/27/1 -> Po21 & 6/20/1 -> Po25 ASN: 33438 IPv4: 206.108.255.189/24 & 206.108.255.190/24 IPv6: 2001:504:27:0:0:829E::1/64 & 2001:504:27:0:0:829E::2/64 Peering Contact: peering(a)stackpath.com Route Servers: YES BFD: No Welcome Aboard! Jeremy Lumby Minnesota VoIP 9217 17th Ave S #216 Bloomington, MN 55425 Main: 612-355-7740 Direct: 612-392-6814 Fax: 952-873-7425 jlumby(a)mnvoip.com

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MICE UG40 Minutes
by AnthonyAnderberg＠nuvera.net March 12, 2022

March 12, 2022

One correction from the meeting: In the treasurers report I stated that we’d reimbursed Richard Laager $2704.44 for new server hardware, I was reading the wrong column in the report - the amount reimbursed was actually $1576.65. I’ve updated these notes to correct that, as always let me know if anyone sees anything else wrong or silly. Cheers, anthony

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MICE RS3 Removal
by Jay Hanke March 9, 2022

March 9, 2022

The MICE RS3 route server in Albert Lea will be removed from service on 3/18/2022. Please turn down any remaining BGP sessions used for testing. Thanks! -- Jay Hanke, President South Front Networks jayhanke(a)southfront.io Phone 612-204-0000

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Omnitech Port Move
by Jay Hanke March 9, 2022

March 9, 2022

Omnitech has moved from Eth10 of the SFN MICE remote to port Eth7/3 of the MICE 100G remote. -- Jay Hanke, President South Front Networks jayhanke(a)southfront.io Phone 612-204-0000

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CL Tel Port Upgrade/Move
by Jay Hanke March 8, 2022

March 8, 2022

CL Tel has moved to the SFN 100G Remote Ports -Port Channel 2 -Ethernet5/1 -Ethernet8/1 The new connection is now 20G (2x10G). IP information remains the same. Welcome aboard! -- Jay Hanke, President South Front Networks jayhanke(a)southfront.io Phone 612-204-0000

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Fiber Minnesota Satellite Upgrade
by Dean Bahls March 7, 2022

March 7, 2022

Good morning! FM (CNS) is going to upgrade our satellite switch on Tuesday, March 15 @ 9:00am. We are going to have BGP shut down on the core switch to keep the process as graceful as possible. The new switch is installed, powered up and configured, so it is mostly just a migration of optics and jumpers. We expect the entire process to take <30 minutes. Mostly this is an FYI to everyone that you'll see a disruption in connectivity to our downstream customers at this time. Oh, and Anthony may have to do some work in Cacti as well. Please let me know if you have any questions about this. Thanks, Dean Dean Bahls Network Operations Manager | Fiber Minnesota 14 Main St SW | PO Box J | Menahga, MN 56464 218.564-1321 (Direct) | 218.564.3000 (Main Office) <mailto:dean.bahls@fiberminnesota.com> dean.bahls(a)fiberminnesota.com

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Please welcome Great Plains Network to MICE!
by Jeremy Lumby March 2, 2022

March 2, 2022

Name: Great Plains Network Switch: WiscNet Port: et-0/0/17 (ae8.100) ASN: 11317 IPv4: 206.108.255.187/24 IPv6: 2001:504:27:0:0:2C35::1/64 Peering Contact: peering(a)greatplains.net Route Servers: Yes BFD: Yes Welcome Aboard! Jeremy Lumby Minnesota VoIP 9217 17th Ave S #216 Bloomington, MN 55425 Main: 612-355-7740 Direct: 612-392-6814 Fax: 952-873-7425 jlumby(a)mnvoip.com

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FCC 22-18A1 Secure Internet Routing Notice of Inquiry
by Richard Laager March 2, 2022

March 2, 2022

The FCC is looking into BGP security. In general, I'm certainly for BGP security, but I haven't seriously analyzed the questions in this Notice of Inquiry. I'm not sure whether this is something MICE would want to comment on or not. Is anyone else looking into this? I've made an inquiry with MTA, since I'm on the CyberSecurity committee there. -- Richard

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Mice outage
by Steve Savoy March 2, 2022

March 2, 2022

Hi everyone, I have not been notified of maintenance windows - two days in a row. Anyone else? [cid:image001.png@01D82E0B.0876C8F0] Thanks, Steve Confidentiality Notice: This correspondence is the property of Winnebago Cooperative Telecom Association and is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply email and destroy all copies of the original message.

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SFN MICE Port Moves
by Jay Hanke March 2, 2022

March 2, 2022

The following connections have been moved from the old SFN 10G MICE remote to the new SFN 100G MICE remote Omnitel Eth5/2 CSTech LAG #1 Eth5/3 EIDG LAG #1 Eth5/4 Router12 Eth6/2 CSTech LAG #2 Eth6/3 EIDG LAG #2 Eth6/4 CSTech Po3 EIDG Po4 -- Jay Hanke, President South Front Networks jayhanke(a)southfront.io Phone 612-204-0000

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[OT] Lumen TDM Issues
by Richard Laager Feb. 28, 2022

Feb. 28, 2022

Since this is the unofficial Minnesota outages list... We (Wiktel) cannot reach certain things (e.g. Verizon cell phones) through the Lumen access tandem in Grand Forks. Another nearby LEC has confirmed the same. We also have an SS7 DS1 down to Inteliquent (as formerly INS). Lumen is "already working tickets related to multiple DS1’s, DS3 down in North Dakota". -- Richard

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MICE Bylaws Changes
by Richard Laager Feb. 25, 2022

Feb. 25, 2022

At the last meeting, we discussed various bylaws issues. This started with the quorum issue. I was short on the official notice period for the last meeting, plus there was a desire for legal advice on certain questions, so we held off on voting on things. As promised, I engaged a lawyer at Moss & Barnett. I consulted with him on the questions, he drafted bylaws changes, I reviewed them, and then the board reviewed them. The results of this are below. I have numbered the changes for ease of reference, but the order is not significant; each amendment is standalone. The Board recommends adoption of all changes. The Proposed (all changes) and Current bylaws are attached. Please review and comment here on the mailing list. Out of respect for people's time, I would like to avoid a long interactive meeting, limiting that to primarily voting. "Speak now or forever hold your peace" as it were. *Change 1: Quorum* This is the issue that we have discussed at length before. There seemed to be a consensus on this previously. Our lawyer's view was that the proposed language was fine. But when he actually integrated it into the text, he did use slightly different structure, giving them "(i)" and "(ii)" prefixes. So this is now using the lawyer's wording. ACTION: Amend the first sentence of section 1.11 "Quorum" to insert the words, "the lesser of (i) ten (10) members entitled to vote or (ii)", such that it now reads: Members representing _the lesser of (i) ten (10) members entitled to vote or (ii)_ ten percent (10%) of the voting power of the membership interests entitled to vote at a meeting of the members are a quorum for the transaction of business. *Change 2: Affiliates* As discussed at the last meeting, we wanted to add to the bylaws (where it belongs) the longstanding MICE policy that affiliated members (e.g. parent companies and subsidiaries) only get one vote. We specifically wanted to get a lawyer to draft the language for defining this. Originally, we were (or at least I was) thinking that we wanted self-executing language (e.g. if two members merge, one of the entities /automatically/ loses membership status). The lawyer strongly advised against this. First off, for that to work, the language has to be deterministic at the point the e.g. merger happens. For example, there is no way for the merged entities to indicate which will be the member moving forward. Second, he advised this creates a risk of ultra vires actions. Imagine some members merge, then we elect a board member in a nearly-tied election, then the board makes some decisions, etc. etc. Later, we find out about a merger that predated the election, and that changed the result of the election. Now you have to try to unwind all that? While that particular possibility is remote, ultimately he recommended a different approach, which is what is taken here. This change creates an affirmative duty for members to notify MICE of mergers. It allows the board to refuse to admit the second entity (for new member scenarios) and to terminate the membership of all-but-one affiliate (for e.g. the merger scenario). This is the procedure we have been using. This also includes a language cleanup to clarify what "Board" means. This is just a cleanup. The Bylaws allow the Board to amend the membership qualifications section, and that was the original plan discussed at the last meeting. But since the members are already voting on bylaws changes, the board is bringing this to the members too. This also allows for the language cleanup in section 1.1 and the section 1.16 change. ACTION: Amend section 1.1 "Membership Qualifications" to make the existing text subsection "(a)". Amend section 1.1 (a) to insert the text, " of Governors of the Company (the “Board” or “Board of Governors”)" after the first occurrence of "Board", such that it reads: In order to qualify for membership, a member shall be: (i) an operator of an internet protocol network which has one or more direct, or approved indirect, connections to Midwest Internet Cooperative Exchange LLC’s (the “Company”) switches; or (ii) an operator of equipment providing approved indirect connections; or (iii) an operator of a colocation data center in which the Company’s switches are located. A member may be elected by the membership or appointed to membership by the Board_of Governors of the Company (the “Board” or “Board of Governors”)_. Members may have such other qualifications as the Board may prescribe by amendment to this Operating Agreement. Add a subsection 1.1 (b) that reads: Each member shall have an affirmative duty to disclose the identity each of its Affiliates that is a member of the Company. “Affiliate” means, with respect to any entity, (i) any other entity directly or indirectly controlling, controlled by, or under common control with such specified entity, or (ii) any other person or entity owning or controlling fifty percent (50%) or more of the outstanding voting securities of such entity. For purposes of the foregoing, the term “control” (including, with correlative meanings, the terms “controlled by” and “under common control with”), as applied to any entity, means the possession, directly or indirectly, of the power to cause the direction of the management and policies of such entity, whether through the ownership of voting or other securities, by contract or otherwise. The Board may refuse to admit any entity that is an Affiliate of a member or may condition such admission on the acknowledgment that such entity and each of its Affiliates, will only have one member vote which may only be exercised by one of the affiliated members. Amend section 1.16 "Resignation, Expulsion or Suspension of Members" to add a subsection (d) that reads: Notwithstanding the foregoing, the Board may terminate the membership of one or more members who are Affiliates, such that such Affiliates shall only have one member vote. The intention of this provision is to prevent the concentration of voting power in members who are under common ownership or common control. *Change 3: Action Without a Meeting* This cleanup was proposed by the lawyer, when reviewing the bylaws. The first sentence says that we can do things without a meeting by /every single member/ consenting to it. As a practical matter, that would never happen. It's also duplicative, since the second sentence says we can do things without a meeting with a /majority/ of all members. ACTION: Amend section 1.13 "Action Without a Meeting" to strike the first sentence, "Any action required or permitted to be taken at a meeting of the members may be taken by written action signed, or consented to by authenticated electronic communication, by all the members entitled to vote on such action." *Change 4: Removal of Board Members* The lawyer found a number of concerns in the existing language (drafting errors, referencing the wrong statute, etc.) and procedure. He basically felt that it needed to be thrown out and completely redrafted. The current bylaws allow the members to remove a governor, with or without cause, by a "[two-thirds] majority" (drafting errors per original). At our current size, this is effectively impossible. The proposed change allows the members to remove a governor, with or without cause, by a majority (of /all/ members, not just those voting on the issue), which is still a very high bar, but far more possible should the need arise. The current bylaws allow the board to remove a governor only if the board appointed that governor in the first place. The proposed change allows the board to remove a governor for cause (which is defined in quite a bit of detail) or disability (also defined). The Board had significant discussion on this change. There are two directly opposite concerns here, and any solution is going to involve some compromise. First, it is desirable to be able to remove a governor, promptly, when this is legitimate. Second, it is desirable to slow down or prevent removing a governor when this is illegitimate. We ultimately went back to the lawyer asking him to provide a mechanism by which a removal could be reviewed by the members. This ended up raising the question of notice to the removed governor. Initially notice was required by implication; this was made explicit. As part of this, section 1.14(d) "Notice to Members" was then copied, with s/member/governor (and the "(1)" and "(2)" labels removed), as 2.11(c). ACTION: Amend section 2.11 to add a subsection (c) which reads: Any notice to governors given by the Company or the Board by a form of electronic communication consented to by the governor to whom the notice is given is effective when given. The notice is deemed given by: (i) facsimile communication, when directed to a telephone number at which the governor has consented to receive notice; (ii) electronic mail, when directed to an electronic mail address at which the governor has consented to receive notice; (iii) a posting on an electronic network on which the governor has consented to receive notice, together with separate notice to the governor of the specific posting, upon the later of: (i) the posting; and (ii) the giving of the separate notice; and (iv) any other form of electronic communication by which the governor has consented to receive notice, when directed to the governor. Consent by a governor to notice given by electronic communication may be given in writing or by authenticated electronic communication. The Company and the Board is entitled to rely on any consent so given until revoked by such governor, provided that no revocation affects the validity of any notice given before receipt by the Company or the Board of revocation of the consent. Replace the contents of section 2.17 "Removal of Governors" entirety with: (a) _Removal for Cause or Disability by the Governors_. The Board may remove a governor for Cause or Disability by the unanimous vote of the governors, excluding the governor to be removed (the “_Voting Governors_”). “_Cause_” shall exist if the Voting Governors determine in good faith that the governor to be removed (i) has failed to discharge his, her, or their duties as governor in good faith, (ii) has breached his, her, or their fiduciary duties to the Company or its members, (iii) has committed theft, embezzlement or conversion of Company property, (iv) has engaged in any illegal activity or fraud in connection with the Company, (v) has been convicted of a felony or other crime involving moral turpitude, while a governor; (vi) has engaged in a conflict of interest without complying with Section 5.1 and 5.2 of this operating agreement or (vii) has engaged in acts or omissions which the Board reasonably deems to be materially damaging to the name, reputation, or business of the Company or which could jeopardize the good will or relationship with its member or other persons and entities important to its mission. “_Disability_” a physical or mental impairment which prevents the governor from performing his, her, or their duties as a governor for a period of not less than 6 months. The Board shall send a written notice to the removed governor stating the basis for their removal under this Section 2.17(a), within three (3) business days following a Board vote removing a such governor. (b) _Retention Vote by Members_. In the event the Board has removed a governor solely for the reasons stated in Section 2.17(a)(i) or (vii) (and not for any other reason constituting Cause or Disability), the removed governor within ten (10) business days following the dispatch of the notice of removal may provide a notice of disagreement with such removal and a request to submit such matters to the vote of the Members. The Board shall call a meeting of the Members to vote on the retention of such governor to be held within 30 days. Prior to such meeting, the governor shall continue to be removed subject to later reinstatement by the Members by affirmative vote. If the governor is not reinstated by affirmative vote, the position shall be filled by a vote of the Members. If notice by the removed governor is not given within ten (10) business days, the removed governor shall have waived his or her right to challenge the removal. No governor shall have the right to appeal or challenge a removal by the Board under Section 2.17(a), except as expressly set forth in this Section 2.17(b) (c) _Removal by Members_. Any one or all of the governors may be removed at any time, with or without cause, by the affirmative vote of a majority of the voting power of all membership interests entitled to vote at an election of governors. -- Richard

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Re: MICE Bylaws Changes
by Nevin Lyne Feb. 25, 2022

Feb. 25, 2022

Wanted to say thank you to Richard as well! -Nevin -- -- Nevin Lyne -- Founder and Director of Technology -- Arcustech, LLC - https://www.arcustech.com/ > On Thu, Feb 24, 2022, at 10:55 PM, Shaun Carlson wrote: >> I concur, these seem like positive changes to support to growth and >> continued operations of the exchange. Thanks Richard for all of this >> effort. >> >> s >> >> On Thu, Feb 24, 2022 at 21:26 Reid Fishler >> <0000000c9d62e487-dmarc-request(a)lists.iphouse.net> wrote: >>> I just want to be the first to mention how much work Richard has put into this as the person interfacing with the laywer, and personally thank him for his dedication to it. Thanks! >>> >>> Reid >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Feb 24, 2022 at 11:19 PM Richard Laager <rlaager(a)wiktel.com> wrote: >>>> At the last meeting, we discussed various bylaws issues. This started with the quorum issue. I was short on the official notice period for the last meeting, plus there was a desire for legal advice on certain questions, so we held off on voting on things. >>>> >>>> As promised, I engaged a lawyer at Moss & Barnett. I consulted with him on the questions, he drafted bylaws changes, I reviewed them, and then the board reviewed them. The results of this are below. I have numbered the changes for ease of reference, but the order is not significant; each amendment is standalone. >>>> >>>> The Board recommends adoption of all changes. >>>> >>>> The Proposed (all changes) and Current bylaws are attached. >>>> >>>> Please review and comment here on the mailing list. Out of respect for people's time, I would like to avoid a long interactive meeting, limiting that to primarily voting. "Speak now or forever hold your peace" as it were. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> *Change 1: Quorum* >>>> >>>> This is the issue that we have discussed at length before. There seemed to be a consensus on this previously. Our lawyer's view was that the proposed language was fine. But when he actually integrated it into the text, he did use slightly different structure, giving them "(i)" and "(ii)" prefixes. So this is now using the lawyer's wording. >>>> >>>> ACTION: >>>> >>>> Amend the first sentence of section 1.11 "Quorum" to insert the words, "the lesser of (i) ten (10) members entitled to vote or (ii)", such that it now reads: >>>> >>>>> Members representing _the lesser of (i) ten (10) members entitled to vote or (ii)_ ten percent (10%) of the voting power of the membership interests entitled to vote at a meeting of the members are a quorum for the transaction of business. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> *Change 2: Affiliates* >>>> >>>> As discussed at the last meeting, we wanted to add to the bylaws (where it belongs) the longstanding MICE policy that affiliated members (e.g. parent companies and subsidiaries) only get one vote. We specifically wanted to get a lawyer to draft the language for defining this. >>>> >>>> Originally, we were (or at least I was) thinking that we wanted self-executing language (e.g. if two members merge, one of the entities *automatically* loses membership status). The lawyer strongly advised against this. First off, for that to work, the language has to be deterministic at the point the e.g. merger happens. For example, there is no way for the merged entities to indicate which will be the member moving forward. Second, he advised this creates a risk of ultra vires actions. Imagine some members merge, then we elect a board member in a nearly-tied election, then the board makes some decisions, etc. etc. Later, we find out about a merger that predated the election, and that changed the result of the election. Now you have to try to unwind all that? While that particular possibility is remote, ultimately he recommended a different approach, which is what is taken here. >>>> >>>> This change creates an affirmative duty for members to notify MICE of mergers. It allows the board to refuse to admit the second entity (for new member scenarios) and to terminate the membership of all-but-one affiliate (for e.g. the merger scenario). This is the procedure we have been using. >>>> >>>> This also includes a language cleanup to clarify what "Board" means. This is just a cleanup. >>>> >>>> The Bylaws allow the Board to amend the membership qualifications section, and that was the original plan discussed at the last meeting. But since the members are already voting on bylaws changes, the board is bringing this to the members too. This also allows for the language cleanup in section 1.1 and the section 1.16 change. >>>> >>>> ACTION: >>>> >>>> Amend section 1.1 "Membership Qualifications" to make the existing text subsection "(a)". >>>> >>>> Amend section 1.1 (a) to insert the text, " of Governors of the Company (the “Board” or “Board of Governors”)" after the first occurrence of "Board", such that it reads: >>>> >>>>> In order to qualify for membership, a member shall be: (i) an operator of an internet protocol network which has one or more direct, or approved indirect, connections to Midwest Internet Cooperative Exchange LLC’s (the “Company”) switches; or (ii) an operator of equipment providing approved indirect connections; or (iii) an operator of a colocation data center in which the Company’s switches are located. A member may be elected by the membership or appointed to membership by the Board_ of Governors of the Company (the “Board” or “Board of Governors”)_. Members may have such other qualifications as the Board may prescribe by amendment to this Operating Agreement. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Add a subsection 1.1 (b) that reads: >>>> >>>>> Each member shall have an affirmative duty to disclose the identity each of its Affiliates that is a member of the Company. “Affiliate” means, with respect to any entity, (i) any other entity directly or indirectly controlling, controlled by, or under common control with such specified entity, or (ii) any other person or entity owning or controlling fifty percent (50%) or more of the outstanding voting securities of such entity. For purposes of the foregoing, the term “control” (including, with correlative meanings, the terms “controlled by” and “under common control with”), as applied to any entity, means the possession, directly or indirectly, of the power to cause the direction of the management and policies of such entity, whether through the ownership of voting or other securities, by contract or otherwise. The Board may refuse to admit any entity that is an Affiliate of a member or may condition such admission on the acknowledgment that such entity and each of its Affiliates, will only have one member vote which may only be exercised by one of the affiliated members. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> Amend section 1.16 "Resignation, Expulsion or Suspension of Members" to add a subsection (d) that reads: >>>> >>>>> Notwithstanding the foregoing, the Board may terminate the membership of one or more members who are Affiliates, such that such Affiliates shall only have one member vote. The intention of this provision is to prevent the concentration of voting power in members who are under common ownership or common control. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> *Change 3: Action Without a Meeting* >>>> >>>> This cleanup was proposed by the lawyer, when reviewing the bylaws. The first sentence says that we can do things without a meeting by *every single member* consenting to it. As a practical matter, that would never happen. It's also duplicative, since the second sentence says we can do things without a meeting with a *majority* of all members. >>>> >>>> ACTION: >>>> >>>> Amend section 1.13 "Action Without a Meeting" to strike the first sentence, "Any action required or permitted to be taken at a meeting of the members may be taken by written action signed, or consented to by authenticated electronic communication, by all the members entitled to vote on such action." >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> *Change 4: Removal of Board Members* >>>> >>>> The lawyer found a number of concerns in the existing language (drafting errors, referencing the wrong statute, etc.) and procedure. He basically felt that it needed to be thrown out and completely redrafted. >>>> >>>> The current bylaws allow the members to remove a governor, with or without cause, by a "[two-thirds] majority" (drafting errors per original). At our current size, this is effectively impossible. The proposed change allows the members to remove a governor, with or without cause, by a majority (of *all* members, not just those voting on the issue), which is still a very high bar, but far more possible should the need arise. >>>> >>>> The current bylaws allow the board to remove a governor only if the board appointed that governor in the first place. The proposed change allows the board to remove a governor for cause (which is defined in quite a bit of detail) or disability (also defined). >>>> >>>> The Board had significant discussion on this change. There are two directly opposite concerns here, and any solution is going to involve some compromise. First, it is desirable to be able to remove a governor, promptly, when this is legitimate. Second, it is desirable to slow down or prevent removing a governor when this is illegitimate. >>>> >>>> We ultimately went back to the lawyer asking him to provide a mechanism by which a removal could be reviewed by the members. This ended up raising the question of notice to the removed governor. Initially notice was required by implication; this was made explicit. As part of this, section 1.14(d) "Notice to Members" was then copied, with s/member/governor (and the "(1)" and "(2)" labels removed), as 2.11(c). >>>> >>>> ACTION: >>>> >>>> Amend section 2.11 to add a subsection (c) which reads: >>>> >>>>> Any notice to governors given by the Company or the Board by a form of electronic communication consented to by the governor to whom the notice is given is effective when given. The notice is deemed given by: >>>>> >>>>> (i) facsimile communication, when directed to a telephone number at which the governor has consented to receive notice; >>>>> >>>>> (ii) electronic mail, when directed to an electronic mail address at which the governor has consented to receive notice; >>>>> >>>>> (iii) a posting on an electronic network on which the governor has consented to receive notice, together with separate notice to the governor of the specific posting, upon the later of: (i) the posting; and (ii) the giving of the separate notice; and >>>>> >>>>> (iv) any other form of electronic communication by which the governor has consented to receive notice, when directed to the governor. >>>>> >>>>> Consent by a governor to notice given by electronic communication may be given in writing or by authenticated electronic communication. The Company and the Board is entitled to rely on any consent so given until revoked by such governor, provided that no revocation affects the validity of any notice given before receipt by the Company or the Board of revocation of the consent. >>>>> >>>> Replace the contents of section 2.17 "Removal of Governors" entirety with: >>>> >>>> >>>>> (a) _Removal for Cause or Disability by the Governors_. The Board may remove a governor for Cause or Disability by the unanimous vote of the governors, excluding the governor to be removed (the “_Voting Governors_”). “_Cause_” shall exist if the Voting Governors determine in good faith that the governor to be removed (i) has failed to discharge his, her, or their duties as governor in good faith, (ii) has breached his, her, or their fiduciary duties to the Company or its members, (iii) has committed theft, embezzlement or conversion of Company property, (iv) has engaged in any illegal activity or fraud in connection with the Company, (v) has been convicted of a felony or other crime involving moral turpitude, while a governor; (vi) has engaged in a conflict of interest without complying with Section 5.1 and 5.2 of this operating agreement or (vii) has engaged in acts or omissions which the Board reasonably deems to be materially damaging to the name, reputation, or business of the Company or which could jeopardize the good will or relationship with its member or other persons and entities important to its mission. “_Disability_” a physical or mental impairment which prevents the governor from performing his, her, or their duties as a governor for a period of not less than 6 months. The Board shall send a written notice to the removed governor stating the basis for their removal under this Section 2.17(a), within three (3) business days following a Board vote removing a such governor. >>>>> >>>>> (b) _Retention Vote by Members_. In the event the Board has removed a governor solely for the reasons stated in Section 2.17(a)(i) or (vii) (and not for any other reason constituting Cause or Disability), the removed governor within ten (10) business days following the dispatch of the notice of removal may provide a notice of disagreement with such removal and a request to submit such matters to the vote of the Members. The Board shall call a meeting of the Members to vote on the retention of such governor to be held within 30 days. Prior to such meeting, the governor shall continue to be removed subject to later reinstatement by the Members by affirmative vote. If the governor is not reinstated by affirmative vote, the position shall be filled by a vote of the Members. If notice by the removed governor is not given within ten (10) business days, the removed governor shall have waived his or her right to challenge the removal. No governor shall have the right to appeal or challenge a removal by the Board under Section 2.17(a), except as expressly set forth in this Section 2.17(b) >>>>> >>>>> (c) _Removal by Members_. Any one or all of the governors may be removed at any time, with or without cause, by the affirmative vote of a majority of the voting power of all membership interests entitled to vote at an election of governors. >>>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Richard >>>> >>>> To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: >>>> http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1 >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Reid Fishler >>> Senior Director >>> Hurricane Electric >>> +1-510-580-4178 >>> >>> To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: >>> http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1 >>> >> -- >> >> >> Shaun Carlson >> >> Director of R&D and Continuous Innovation >> >> 218.346.8673 | shaun.carlson(a)arvig.com | Schedule a meeting >> >> Arvig | 150 Second Street SW | Perham, MN 56573 | arvig.com >> >> >> To unsubscribe from the MICE-DISCUSS list, click the following link: >> http://lists.iphouse.net/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=MICE-DISCUSS&A=1

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Advanced Communications
by Richard Laager Feb. 24, 2022

Feb. 24, 2022

Anyone know which MICE member also goes by Advanced Communications? -- Richard

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Please welcome Savage Communications Inc. to MICE!
by Jeremy Lumby Feb. 23, 2022

Feb. 23, 2022

Name: Savage Communications Inc. Switch: MICE Main Port: E6/19/1 ASN: 23260 IPv4: This is a port upgrade, all IP info remains the same. The new connection will be 100G IPv6: Peering Contact: peering(a)scicable.net Route Servers: Yes BFD: Yes Welcome Aboard Again! Jeremy Lumby Minnesota VoIP 9217 17th Ave S #216 Bloomington, MN 55425 Main: 612-355-7740 Direct: 612-392-6814 Fax: 952-873-7425 jlumby(a)mnvoip.com

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